UK Worried Putin May Get Challenger 2 Tank Secrets, Takes These Urgent Steps l Russia-Ukraine War

When you build a weapon, one must expect losses

One of my ideas is to produce some decoy tanks without core secrets for the opponent to pay a larger loss to obtain, and then use the official version on a large scale.

1. Do not send the Challenger II to Ukraine.
2. Do exactly what the US is doing with the Abrams that are going to be sent Ukraine.
3. Option #2 is the best choice if the Brits want to prevent the secrets of the tank's armor to fall into Russian hands, but would also make the Challenger II much easier to knockout with conventional armor piercing rounds from a Russian AFV/IFV and ATGMs at any range.

Since Chobham armor was first invented in the 1970s, I very much doubt the Russians don't already have the technology. Also, if the Brits are going to put those kinds of restrictions on the tanks use, they might as well keep them, since they will do no good for Ukraine. If you're afraid to put tanks onto the battlefield, all they really are is a static display somewhere.

Exactly what said, check my posts, these will never see the front lines as NATO is terrified of loosing these, they are more symbolic piece like a big statue in a town square. Same for M1s , only the Leopard will see combat as the will “export approved” models that are +30 year old technology and seeing they can be destroyed by single advanced penetrating weapon of any modern type. Just like all modern tanks! They need so much more to be effective.

soviet-era tanks will go to front of Challenger 2 and leopard 2 for scouting and situational awareness with Drone for them as their shield and Abrams will stay at their behind as last defense as last stage in order to save fuel consumption and ammunition. Brandley, marder and AMX-10RC will support and protect Soviet-era tank at front of western tanks.

According to Tass, a large chemical manufacturer in Russia has agreed to pay $70,000 to each soldier that captures or destroys western tanks. That is a driving incentive for certain.

It would be expected that with the number of C2s there will be a couple of CRARRVs to repair or recover back to safety... I'm pleased that the C2s sound like they will be travelling to Ukraine with full armour to protect the crews..... Always take what the "Sun" says with a huge pinch of salt

If Russia *does* get an example of the Challenger 2 tank, then they'll at least be able to bring their tank technology up to where the West was 20 years ago, because that's when the Challenger 2 was developed. It has now been superceded by the Challenger 3, with uprated systems and armour, which won't be going to Ukraine.....

Not sure you can class The Sun as a newspaper, toilet paper maybe. We, UK and US, are supporting Ukraine as per the Budapest Memorandum, if we had stepped up in 2014, this war would probably not be happening. Hopefully they don’t use the AA or RAC for recovery as it takes them 8-10 hours to recover a Land Rover Defender, in my experience. 😂

Only way to do this is to limit it's use in the frontlines as much as possible.

Send another tank to retrieve the damaged tank in a war zone. Simple. Just set up a stop war sign. Remove the tank and then restart the special military operation

In war there is no best tank , the best is the user ..

Great, so the 1st target is the foreign recovery crews then take out the tank🤗

Russia has already said that if NATO tanks use uranium armor piercing rounds they will consider it a nuclear attack against Russian soldiers and will counter with a nuclear response.

Sending private military contractors would be the beginning of a direct confrontation!

If you want to ensure that the secrets of the tanks sent to Ukrain will be safe is sure to make it unsafe.

0:40: Dead men walking; 3:34: "Having private military contractors on standby to recover the tanks". Who they might be, these contractors?

Before it was Ukraine getting gifted russian tanks, now it will be ukraine gifting russia these new tanks 😆

It's like when you lend a shoe to some one and you give instructions on how to walk 🤣🤣🤣

Russia knows everything there is to know about the Challenger. Nothing new to learn, just a good trophy.

As if Challenger 2 has some secrets why Sunak need to pretend to worry ? Should more focus on the War goes out of control and no return point.

the more simple and secure is not use the tanks in " near fight "!

Challenger 2 is a fairly old but still one of the best tanks in the world.
You could give Russia one and they still do not have the technology and funds to try and copy it.
Plus they will be to busy running away.

No doubt it will fall and its an opportunity

Equip Challenger 2 tank's with self-destruction system. ✌️

I noted that Russia will pay big bounty for Leopard tank, but a Challenger tank is not mentioned. Does it mean that they are worthless to the Russians?

If one if the challenger is destroyed by ally that means those rpg shot at it are not properly use and or old model's of rpg

That was why I was vehemently opposed to sending these tanks. Insane that this is only now a concern after the authorization was given .

Keep the tanks safe😂 for god sake, it’s a war…😅

---- > Military contractors who can stand by to collect the tanks sounds like the best idea. This is why Ukraine needs planes, air support for their tank operations.

I mean lol, tanks primary role as weapon is to advance and break the enemy lines.I watched a US General on CNN say Russians couldn't make a A1M1 even if we send them one as gift in 10 years.They have no tech or the materials to do it is basically what he meant.

They may get secrets from lepeard ,challenger and the Abrams!

The Abrams will not be "neutered" the extra armor made of depleted uranium will be replaced with extra armor with tungsten instead, the US did that with other exported versions of the Abrams as well.

Putin: I wasn’t bluffing joe 😏

Combine old Soviet tank and western modern tank use combine forces to safe Abraham Challenger leopard

The Challenger was designed to fight Russian tank's, you cannot worry about secrets being taken. The secrets of the armour will probably be too hard for Russia to replicate anyway, even if they could replicate it, it would take a large number of year's before they can mount it or redesign anti tank missiles.

Quoting “the sun” 😂

Challenger 2 is over 70 tons!!! Russian support vehicles, bridges, and tanks can carry/pull 46 tons! It would be Ukraine equipped to retrieve from the battlefield!🤔

I think 🤔 the technology of challenger tanks could not be hide from Russia. If tank is destroyed, it would be impossible to transfer to safe zone in war events?.

The challenger 2 is just another tank, a sitting doc for anti-tank missiles and drones.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if ruZZia hasn't already had their hands on this and other western tanks. The U.S. has obtained nearly everything ruZZia has produced.
Note the Chobham armor has went through multiple upgrades and improvements. Just send them with a prior Chobham armor if concerned.
As to reverse engineering. Much easier said then done. Take something with a dozen ingredients and you have billions of possibilities of which only a few combinations will give a similar result.
It's true that with today's technology, you can determine what and approximately how much of each element it contains. But unless you know how it was processed and how it all comes together, it means very little. Consider a rum cake made with rum, but the end product contains no alcohol.
China's been trying to reverse engineer ruZZian jet engines(supplied by ruZZia) for over 40 years, but are just now getting something close to being practical. India has been at it nearly as long as China.
The U.S. with access to all the western expertise probably does reverse engineering better than anyone else, but it is complex and doesn't always work out.
I once had associations with a metallurgist who said there's billions of possible metal combinations and we have no idea what the outcome of them would be until we actually do it. We are comparably in the stone age in understanding the science of metals.

Making money is an action. Keeping money is behavior, but Growing money is Wisdom..i figured this out weeks ago. money is always eager and ready to work for anyone who is ready to employ it.

I say Russia will have one in a week or two. One S300 or S400 per tank.
And all the support and wrecked tank recovery staff goes with it.

Good news for the Russia 🇷🇺 admits

These concerns reveal the underlying flaw in all NATO thinking: the certainty that large scale war would never happen again. What's the point of building them if you can't use them.

Lmao let’s just announce this to the world, why don’t you. Going through this training is not going to be the same when you get in the five yard line. It’s a start, but once it’s for real, with no respawns, it’s a whole new ball game. This isn’t light infantry anymore. Now you’re restricted in line of sight. And have 5 secs to make decisions, or that’s all she wrote for you.

Have 1 Para on standby for battlefield recovery.

If I'm Putin I would have no reservations sacrificing 50,000 soldiers to recover one challenger 2 tank.

All good intentions, however this now places the highest price on their tanks. With the Wagner criminals in play, they will likely shape the battle to capture a Challenger tank as a trophy and extra cash bouns!

Just leave it to the warthunder forums for all secrets

Not really sure if nato even remembers how to fight a large scale ground war! If you don't train for it ! You can't do it !!

Whatever the type of tank, you have to be damn brave or completely mad to wage war in these barbecues.

1:02 exactly why its not sufficient

i mean for all we know trained British, American, and German soldiers, in balaclavas could be out there in the battlefield operating the tanks that are being provided by the three countries, real possibility isn't it.

fit them with self destruct system in case of capture

The Russian Armata is superior to the challenger, leopard and abrams.

why building a tank if you don't use it ?

Fighters have less to lose...

Ghost will recover these tanks 😂😂😂

A situation will happen where your tank crew well abandoned the tank and run for his life and we the Russians will come and role it to safety for you and then up grade it to fight against you. Amen🙏🏿

A ship is safe in harbour but that's not what ships are for.

The best way to keep those tanks safe is to bubble rap them 😂😂

These tanks are old and the challenger 3 is on the way. I get they are careful but it would be naive to think russia hasn't obtained tech specs..... everyone spies on everyone

I don't think the Russians would care. The Challengers won't have state of art sensitive gadgets that you can be certain.

Comedian Zelensky should demand Ferrari cars from Italy to help the army escape the frontline. These tanks are not enough to save Ukraine.

Lol carry on we have challenger 3 tanks in production with a few already done 😂

The fact that the UK is worried about the Challenger getting into the hands of the Russians tells you they are not confident about the outcome of a battle where these tanks maybe involved.

The real secret of challenger is its armour, We've only given that to 1 country, it's unfortunate that that country gave it to every man and his dog. Uncle Sam strikes again.

Save your sleepless nights just go ahead and give Russia one of your tanks.
There is no way anyone who has been given something is going to risk their life to save it when it has been destroyed.
Your kids don't appreciate the car you give them, if it breaks they come back for another.

This is based on a couple of commonsense quotes from UK soldiers (eg: the UK will send recovery vehicles and train the Ukrainians on them), with a sensationalist spin by the tabloid Sun: the UK is 'afraid of the Russians capturing one', so is insisting on ridiculous conditions.
The UK is realistic: there will be tanks lost, not all will be immediately recoverable, and recovery and repair should be planned for.
I suspect that the 'conditions' are the opposite of the Sun's claims: use them as a force multiplier in fast and aggressive combined arms attacks.

He already got'em from War Thunder.

Typical British dithering. By definition any thing or person that goes to war can be lost or damaged ..by definition. Any attempt to preclude that possibility will involve limitations that come with a good possibility of causing increased negative affects. As needful as Ukraine is of these tanks, I seriously doubt they will allow restrictions or oversight. Slava Ukraine!!

C2 was designed in the Cold War and likely has few secrets left by now, with the exception only of some of the more advanced armour packages that in any case will not include the very latest developments earmarked for the intended C3 upgrade. So OK, only 14 C2s have been sent and for various valid reasons, the main one being to pressure Germany into allowing Leopard2 to be provided as well. EVEN SO, THIS ABSURD VID'S CLAIMS are more reminiscent of the LOATHSOME EU's SCUM PROPAGANDA MEDIA or at max, our own spineless politicians and bureaucrats than of UK services personnel who know the realities of war themselves and will NOT expect or advocate ludicrous restrictions that would add yet more risk for UKRAINIAN forces.

Challenger 2 is the worst NATO MBT in frontline service today. It has 3 design features that make it uniquely bad, and no salient positive design features to compensate for them.
Any analysis of the Challenger series needs to take into account that the tank was never meant for British service. It was designed for use by the Iranians when they were still under the rule of the Shah. This was never the best of the best that the UK had to offer. It was designed as a minimum viable product that they could sell to a tinpot dictator.
The design that preceded the Challenger 1 was also famously bad, the Chieftain, a tank with an engine so weak it couldn’t even beat out the German Maybach engines from WWII that were smaller and more reliable. In peacetime, the Chieftain formations in Germany had a readiness rating of around 30%, which is appalling by any standard.
To make all this worse, the Challenger 1/2 have about 2/3 of their frontal hull armor without any kind of NERA protection. It’s just a slab of RHA 80mm thick, which is bad even from WWII standards (the German Panzer IV G also has an 80mm thick lower plate). The driver’s port is also enormous, and has almost no armored protection at all. I suspect you can punch through it with a 35mm autocannon.

If Ukrainians couldn't manage T72 with Abrams and Leopard will break their fingers only once getting in.
The innovation brought to Armata 14 by separating the crew from the turret is the most ingenious feature ever brought to a tank. Three crew members are fully protected in the main chassis and automated loading makes the Armata 14 the best tank ever made, leaving much behind the Abrams and its "turbine jet" as the biggest nonsense in building armored cars ever designed.
Bravo Uncle Ivan! Please show Uncle Sam and Uncle Hans as well the middle finger as in Ukraine all the Abrams tanks will be burnt out in several afternoons as all the ordinary tanks on the field, including the mighty Leopard German tanks.

What does UK expect?

If one attack on the wheels or the chains from the side challenger will get stuck and fall into Russian hands. So, secrets also fall into the Russians.

God bless Mr putin

That Russia will get its hands on a Challenger 2 is inevitable. It is not a question of "if", but "when".

Pretty sure that Russia will take these spoils as the previous ones.They're bidding for a big war but ultimately Ukraine will pay dearly for any nuclear war.

Sad time in the world

A good plan would be to use the Challengers to defend against any incursion from Belorussia or Luhansk.
The worry is reasonable but let's not over estimate the ability of the Russiand to organise a p£$$ up in a vodka distillery.

Sounds like mom’s boy tank 😂😂😂

The real question is not whether Russia can know the secrets of the Challenger 2, but if there will be a Russia left to know the secrets.

Knowing Ukraine they probably would sell the tanks to Russia for a faction of the cost

We shouldn't be sending them anything, I wish they were so keen to help the British people.

Western tanks in ukraine is going to one of the biggest failures for Ukraine to date.

A Russian wife turned to her husband and asked, "What's this special military operation our glorious leader keeps talking about?" Her husband replied, "It's a war to stop America and NATO." "Oh, right” she says “How's it going?"
“Well” he replied “so far we have lost over 20 generals, 120,000 troops killed, countless injured, 3000 tanks, 300 aircraft, hundreds of helicopters, countless armoured vehicles, artillery and trucks, our flagship along with other naval ships, our army is being defeated in most areas and we have had to resort to conscription to replace our losses”.
“Wow” replied the wife “what about America and NATO”?
“They haven’t turned up yet”

The UAF has plenty of training removing ruZZian armor from the battlefield via tanks, bmp or farm tractors. Slava 🤣
Slava Ukraini! 🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦

somnone have any updates on Swedens CV90? are they gona send to Ukraine or is that just lies?

You think it's easy to carry a tank that you don't know how to use

There’s no point in giving Ukraine western tanks if they strip out what makes them better, hell if that’s what they do then they should have shipped all there older tanks long ago like leopard 1s.

Love that saying friendly fire America are number one at that they have it down to fine art

Russia has captureed a lot of western hardwares in this war including himars

If it can be destroyed, what is the purpose studying it useless secret armor technology? So that Russian can reverse engineer and study how not to destroy the tank? 😆

British tanks will fall apart even before firing a shot 🌟😀

Never been breached by enemy fire ?
It was pierced by an IED in Iraq
A challenger hit another challenger and killed 2 crew and blew itself to pieces so you know

Send your troops too and let them see who you are fighting with

There is so much talk & hype about NATO countries providing F-16 to Ukraine....as if Russia is finished if F-16 enters the battle scene...
While they might be having many reasons & compulsions to keep the war going and create hype for the F-16 market.... war is business opportunity for US
BUT...they should remember our Wing Comm. Abhinandan had shot down their F-16 using a Russian origin Mig-21 .. 😬